| |
| Author |
Message |
mx42
Pro
Joined: 11 Jun 2007
Posts: 724
Location: southern california
|
 Posted: Sun Mar 08, 2009 8:51 pm Post subject: |
 |
|
| auburn goalie wrote: | I made a write-up about wide vs. narrow butterflys. Lemme see if I can find it...
well, in some instances, a narrow butterfly would be prefered. it cuts down tension on your joints, you have much better rebound conrol, and you can play more around the sides of the net. for example, if the opposing teams forward is right below the faceoff circle to your left, and he shoots, you would want to use a narrow butterfly because it brings your body closer to the post than if you were in a wide butterfly. Because, if you were in a wide butterfly, your skate would be hitting up against the post, which gives the shooter much more room to shoot for.
On the flip side, the wide butterfly does give you MUCH better width of coverage, which means you take away more room on the ice. And, you can cover a lot more space on the butterfly slide, because if you were in a narrow butterfly, it would have a lot more resistance along the ice, which means you wouldn't be able to go as far. The wide butterfly is also very helpful when you are screened
So you would definently want to get a wide butterfly, but don't forget about the narrow butterfly, just because it dosn't cover as much room.
Just my two cents |
There is a huge debate about this, and each definitely has its pros and cons.
Figure that a wide butterfly has more cons than a narrow one does.
A wider butterfly is:
a) harder to recover from
b) puts more strain on your ligaments
c) does not help much with rebound control (narrow butterfly you can take it into your knee/pant area, wide your thigh rise is covering it, it will shoot out a juicy rebound which goes back to letter a).
d) extraneous coverage - see above picture of the goalie in blue.
e) does not really offer that much more coverage than if you played with a narrow butterfly a 6" - 1 foot above where you normally play.
The best time to rock a wide butterfly would be a screen or tip situation in front where you just want to be as big as possible.
Roy and Giguere are generally regarded as the best to play with this kind of teaching in mind. |
|
|
|
puckstopper135
Hall of Fame
Joined: 13 Feb 2009
Posts: 1523
Location: Ontario
|
| Posted: Sun Mar 08, 2009 9:12 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Itech - What do you mean your coach tells you to use the heel as a center point? Referring to the picture I was critiquing? What advantages are there of NOT having the whole blade on the ice? You can't deflect the pucks into the corners nearly as well, and you have to rely on near perfect pad/knee 5-hole closure. |
|
|
|
TheAntiw00t
Minors
Joined: 05 Nov 2008
Posts: 187
Location: Honolulu, Hawaii
|
| Posted: Sun Mar 08, 2009 9:48 pm Post subject: |
|
|
maybe the thought about stick positioning is based on what kind of butterfly you play, either the wide one or the narrow one. I personally play more wide because of the lack of coverage down low for me in the narrow butterfly, but it could also be because I am very short. So because I play that kind of butterfly I think that stick positioning would have to be flat for me since I don't have complete five hole coverage in the standard butterfly.
_________________
Itech X-Wing Pro C/A
CCM Gatekeeper Pro pants
Vaughn 8600 Epic catch/blocker
Louisville TPS Contour leg pads
Itech NV7 mask
Bauer 1000 inline and ice skates |
|
|
|
itechwarrior
Hall of Fame
Joined: 06 Nov 2008
Posts: 1120
Location: Surrey, BC
|
| Posted: Mon Mar 09, 2009 2:02 am Post subject: |
|
|
| puckstopper135 wrote: | | Itech - What do you mean your coach tells you to use the heel as a center point? Referring to the picture I was critiquing? What advantages are there of NOT having the whole blade on the ice? You can't deflect the pucks into the corners nearly as well, and you have to rely on near perfect pad/knee 5-hole closure. |
Well to be perfectly honest I don't know exactly why, he just told me that's how to do a proper butterfly blocking position. I believe, and I could be wrong, but it's the best way to have your stick because of where your blocker is supposed to be positioned in a proper fly.
It also helps ramp the puck in to your chest, so you can swallow up the puck and leave no rebound. |
|
|
|
puckstopper135
Hall of Fame
Joined: 13 Feb 2009
Posts: 1523
Location: Ontario
|
| Posted: Mon Mar 09, 2009 2:05 am Post subject: |
|
|
You can't really ramp the puck that well if the heel is the only part on the ice though.  Wouldn't it be easier to have the blade flat, and just move the blocker farther down (closer to the pad - although I'm not just referring to the picture anymore)?
I can see how that's where the blocker should be... I always keep my gloves a little more spread out though, kind of "wide butterfly" ish... which would explain why I let more goals in between my arms than anywhere else... |
|
|
|
Vaughn_VIP
High School
Joined: 14 Nov 2008
Posts: 24
|
| Posted: Mon Mar 09, 2009 9:08 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Quote: | | I believe, and I could be wrong, but it's the best way to have your stick because of where your blocker is supposed to be positioned in a proper fly. |
I've been taught to do the exact same thing in my tight (blocking) butterfly, and my coach explained that if the blade is flat on the ice it lifts up your blocker arm a bit so that there is a hole that the puck can slip through, i've also noticed that it's more comfortable for my blocker to be possitioned so that the heel of my stick is the only part that is touching the ice, that might just be me tho.
_________________
Height: 6'1
Weight: 180LBS
Itech 960 Helmet
Vaughn V3 7500 C/A
Vaughn V3 7500 Pants
Bauer XIX Skates
Vaughn V3 7500 Glove
Vaughn V3 7500 Blocker
Vaughn V3 7500 35"+ 3" Pads |
|
|
|
itechwarrior
Hall of Fame
Joined: 06 Nov 2008
Posts: 1120
Location: Surrey, BC
|
| Posted: Mon Mar 09, 2009 9:35 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| puckstopper135 wrote: | | You can't really ramp the puck that well if the heel is the only part on the ice though. |
Why not? It works perfectly.
Remember that heel of your stick is what you use to drive the goalie machine. It leads you (or should) everywhere. Why wouldn't it be the centre of your blocking technique?
The blade should be flat, just the heel in the centre of the 5 hole coverage. |
|
|
|
dirkhorst
College
Joined: 22 Jan 2008
Posts: 86
|
|
|
|
puckstopper135
Hall of Fame
Joined: 13 Feb 2009
Posts: 1523
Location: Ontario
|
| Posted: Fri Mar 13, 2009 9:25 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Itech - I've never been taught to have the heel as a center point, or to lead for that matter
Can anybody else offer some insight as to whether one or the other is right? I'm not saying it's wrong... it just seems odd. But I'll have to try it out when I'm on the ice coaching next. |
|
|
|
Slinky
Minors
Joined: 17 Feb 2009
Posts: 471
Location: Canton, GA
|
| Posted: Fri Mar 13, 2009 10:53 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Leading with the heel sounds more awkward than it is. Basically it's just making sure that the goalie turns his full body so that the entirety of the blade (and by connection your shoulders and body) are moving to the proper positioning with the right angles. 1) Turn your body towards the new angle 2) Skate forwards towards that new position. When you do that, you are leading with your stick, and since you hold the stick in your blocker hand, it feels like "leading with your heel" as strange as that sounds.
It's similar to what i teach my younger goalies. 1) Eyes 2) Shoulders 3) Body. 1) Look where you're going, 2) Square your shoulders up with your new positioning 3) Move there.
The point of either is that when a goalie is required to use the T-Push, the goalie turns his or her entire body towards his new destination immediately prior to moving.
My main contention with the heel-center form of butterfly is that I like to use my stick for directing rebounds into corners, which is best done with your full blade on the ice. I also feel like young goalies tend to dip their blocker side shoulder when they are told to "lead with the heel," which means they're not square to the shooter.
I like to keep my blocker against my body, but to keep my blade flat, it means that I have to let my stick out in front of me, and that can create some difficulties for deflecting shots upwards. It's something I accept and since I know it can happen, I naturally bring my stick in if there is a shot on the ice straight at my 5hole.
_________________
Because it hurts so good.
 |
|
|
|
jmillikin
Squirt
Joined: 15 Mar 2010
Posts: 1
|
| Posted: Mon Mar 15, 2010 11:18 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| k my first post, i am havings trouble getting to a full butterfly? i am close to one, however my pads are not square with the ice. I don't like to play this card but i am double-jointed? could this be the reason? |
|
|
|
montreal961
GoalieForum Legend
Joined: 09 Dec 2006
Posts: 5697
Location: Canada
|
| Posted: Sat Mar 20, 2010 7:10 pm Post subject: |
|
|
That is most likely not the reason.
This is a very common occurrence, believe it or not. Pictures would help, so we can pinpoint the problem. Other then that, i would just tell you to watch videos on Youtube, and try to duplicate.
_________________
 |
|
|
|
casos92
Peewee
Joined: 10 Apr 2010
Posts: 5
|
| Posted: Sat Apr 10, 2010 11:41 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Hey guys, I just started playing roller hockey as goalie and I'm having problems with my butterfly positioning. Everytime i try to go down, both my leg pads end up just face down on the ground, instead of facing the puck/skater. Could it be my pads? Does anyone have a picture of how to butterfly without the pads on? Basically, a picture of what position your legs and knees should be in. |
|
|
|
|
